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Washington Mutual demanda a la FDIC por 17 billones US$ + daños

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Washington Mutual demanda a la FDIC por 17 billones US$ + daños
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Washington Mutual demanda a la FDIC por 17 billones US$ + daños
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#4601

Debemos preocuparnos por la moción de Weil de 50 billones???

Ya se que por aqui algunos no soys muy amigos de los post de Bopfan, pero creo que son post bien desarrollados y con fundamento y que es interesante conocer.

In a way this dust up is a good thing in that it may make things clearer for longs.

To understand why Weil is saying what it is saying you have to deconstruct 'A' and 'L'.

To get a realistic picture of what WMI owes, look at its 6/30/08 10Q. Nothing has changed. The # was around $8 billion, I believe. However, so long as proofs of claim (filed under penalty of perjury) showing a notional debt of $50 billion, Weil must maintain that that is WMI's debt.

On the asset side, A is valued most conservatively at $6.7 billion because litigation recoveries and the NOLs etc., are, technically, 'contingent'.

As the notional debt of $50 billion is well above the contingent assets, Weil can -- and must (because of the '34 Act) -- continue to state what no one believes, i.e., that WMI is hopelessly insolvent.

Smart longs understand the $50 billion is the Wizard of Oz, and are not scared of it. They also understand that at $6.7 in assets WMI is only $1.3 billion from A=L. Accordingly, with $3.5 billion in preferreds, commons would be in the $ for $1 with only $6.5 billion infused from the NOLs and other non-litigation inflows (i.e., $1.3 to make A=L, + $3.5 billion for preferreds, + $1.7 billion for commons = $6.5 billion), which is a number in the vicinity quants on this board have calculated.

Accordingly, this is why I believe commons are holding stubbornly at around $.17. Ps and Ks are being brutally controlled as anyone with Level-II will tell you; Ps would be trading at $200 if not controlled, and commons are selling at at least an 80% discount if you assume the non-litigation inflows are forthcoming.

The preferreds will rise (perhaps dramatically) when Judge Walrath denies Weil's motion, and I see the commons heading north, too, albeit at a slower pace.

Weil is being slick, but I believe it is because it must. As for Quinn taking a larger role, I wondered about that last week but now think it is to emphasize the heightened litigation stance.

#4602

Re: Debemos preocuparnos por la moción de Weil de 50 billones???

Muy bueno el post, pues me parece totalmente razonable lo que dice. El abogado que nos defiende es el que más nos hunde. Que las Ps están manejadas se ve hoy, con casi 6 veces el volumen negociado bajó $2. Parece muy raro.

#4603

Re: Debemos preocuparnos por la moción de Weil de 50 billones???

Este argentino, escribe como un arroz con mango o sea esta en nada, debe haber leido mucha literatura y mitologia griega, le hago recordar que este es un foro sobre wamuq y a nadie verga le interesa su carta su novia o la p. m ubicate, a escribe en un foro infantil, parece que no has tenido infancia cheeee, o mucho condorito te tiene asi

#4604

¿Porque odia Weil el EC?

After Weil's initial motion to disband newly formed official EC, many shareholders were willing to give them the benefit of the doubt, myself included. I even advocated that Weil and EC should be ally working together against our common target JPM/FDIC. Yesterday's filing by Weil of debtor's response to EC, however, was such a huge upset that destroyed any remaining shareholders' trust in Weil instantly. As Mad stated, "I'm done with Weil."

So why is Weil so hostile towards shareholders and attempts to fight EC like hell? Is it because of settlement money? Weil's masters (creditors/bondholders) do not like to share any dollars with shareholders? In the end, it is about the money, both settlement dollars and the future gains following WMI’s reorganization. But right now, however, it's all about the control. Who, creditors/bondholders or shareholders will take control of WMI. It's highly likely, as many board members pointed out, the debtor, JPM, and FDIC, with Weil as mediator, were very close to reach a settlement with creditors/bondholders taking over WMI as a whole without any participation of shareholders. It's a gift given away to big interests, again. With EC installed by U.S. Trustee under "exigent circumstances", their plan (of settlement and reorganization) was disrupted and threatened. As we recall, Weil was brought in days before the seizure. It's also agreed that Weil was hand-picked by Bonderman. It’s also known for a long time that Bonderman had withdrawn himself from WMI's board early on during the bankrupcy process. It's very telling that Bonderman and none of other major shareholders are present at EC, not even at the meeting of its formation. Putting pieces together, I can’t help but think that the big interests might have taken huge stakes in WMI bonds so the perfect explanation of mythical rise of bond prices in the past months. The big whale, who has been swimming silently, now surfaced, although we are still not so sure the individual names inside the whale. But it's clear, the big whale (collectively called creditors/bondholders) wants to swallow the whole estate of WMI, with nothing left for shareholders. Sorry for them, EC disrupted their plan. They are upset and desperate.

Another thing in Weil's reply that upsets, confuses, and worries shareholders is their claim of "$50b unliquidated claims against WMI estate." I pointed out before that where are the missing liquidation values from WMI against JPM/FDIC in Weil's initial objection motion? The EC council sees that too. Now Weil came up with the counter-argument "You (shareholders) think you can wave $20b unliquidated claims [against JPM/FDIC] in front of the court [to justify EC’s existence.], what about the $50b unliquidated claims [against WMI]?" To slap back on their arrogance, I’d suggest, just like some board members pointed out, if Weil truly believes the $50b claims, then the creditors/bondholders are toasted. Then, why are WMI bond prices at mid to high 90s? There is no way they truly believe it. It’s disingenuous for them to make such an argument. To calm our nerves, I’d like to summarize some of board members' wisdom about this issue. (1)"…Their argument is if the equity committee is going to reference $20B in claims that haven't been won yet, what about the $50B that hasn't been expunged yet. They fail to mention that most of the $50B is likely to be expunged and most of the $20B is likely to be recovered for the estate."(by fla_gator). (2)" IIRC, 10 billion is the bogus IRS claim. If we receive a tax refund, I suspect that claim won't stand." (by gibson). (3)"fla_gator and gib have it right, as usual. As discussed long ago, that IRS claim is basically a "placeholder" it filed just as the exclusion date expired just in case they ever came up with a theory of recovery, which they have never articulated. As I recall, another $30 billion dollars is accounted for by a preposterous claim by a pension fund which is suing WMI under some kind of negligence theory, even though its actual investment was a small fraction of the claim." (by viv. All quotes are from ghost's thread "KCCLLC/PACER Documents Galore" of last night.).

If we can see the flaws in Weil's argument, the EC members, its legal council, U.S. Trustee, and the Judge can see them too. Weil’s arguments can fool some of the people. They can't fool all of the people. They can't fool the Judge, U.S. Trustee, and EC, that's for sure.

In conclusion, EC's formation must hit someone’s nerve really hard. It's a good sign. Once EC is affirmed by the Judge, I see no reason that shareholders will not receive their justifiable, long overdue recovery.

#4605

Bopfan: Nadie es perfecto

Aunque entiedo los sentimientos de Maximunae referente a la metedura de pata de Bopfan referente a Weil y sus intenciones, debo decir solo lo siguiente...

La mayoría de los que estamos aquí no habríamos tenido la más remota idea de lo que era WAMPQ ni WAMKQ si no hubiera sido por su ayuda.

A mi me hizo despertar y entrar fuerte en las P´s cuando estaban a $3.50, Bopfan explicó el proceso desde un punto de vista de experta en la materia pero se equivocó ya que nadie pudo pensar que los abogados que defendian a WMI pretendian liquidarnos para darselo todo a los bonistas como ya paso en CIT.

Yo intenté de pasar ese conocimiento para que otros muchos se lucraran en nuestro querido foro que llega a muchas partes por lo que puedo deducir (España, latinoamerica y leo hasta Macao :)

Eso al menos desde mi punto de vistas en gran parte se lo debemos a Bopfan... y como dije en el título nadie es perfecto pero Bopfan se merece mi total gratitud.

Este jueves 28 de enero llegamos al punto de inflexión más importante desde que se inicio el caso, si el EC es finalmente aprobado por la Juez Walrath tendremos un boleto ganador para la lotería pero no sabremos hasta que todo el estado sea valorado de cuanto es ese boleto ganador.

Creedme que llevo esperando este día mucho tiempo ya son 16 meses y una autentica montaña rusa de sentimientos, de acontecimientos, de subidas y bajadas pero mirad donde estamos hoy. Estamos a las puertas de la caja acorazada (donde está el tesoro) y la tenemos rodeada y poniendo los explosivos. Hagamos ahora un esfuerzo conjunto de pensar en positivo y el jueves cuando se apruebe el EC podremos felicitarnos todos por estos meses de sufrimientos.

Se acerca la hora... tic tac!

Nota Final: El jueves no se acaba este caso ni mucho menos sino que empieza la siguiente fase que nos llevará hasta las siguientes fechas clave que son 26 de marzo (Formulación Plan Reorganización) y 26 de mayo (fecha tope para aprobación de dicho Plan). A partir de esas fechas el EC si lo desea será quien decida sobre el plan de reorganización.

Vuelvo a repetir, "Esto no se acaba el jueves pero nos acerca mucho más a la meta".

#4606

Manipulación de WAMKQ y WAMPQ

En los últimos 2 días alguien ha pasado su posición de WAHUQ (ya que está casi cerca a su valor nominal máximo) a WAMKQ, todo empezó con trades de 200 acciones cada 3 minutos hace 2 días y ayer pasaron a ser trades de 400 acciones cada minuto en WAMKQ.

Finalmente ayer tuvo el mayor día de volumen WAMPQ con 61000 acciones de un total de 3 MM acciones totales. Y aun así terminamos en rojo.

El motivo es que ahora mismo hay una disparidad y es mejor tener P´s que tener K´s...así que toma nota Maximunae :)

Sigue el rastro del ballenato...

#4607

Re: Manipulación de WAMKQ y WAMPQ

Joder, ¿y quien puede tradear acciones cada minuto sin que le frían a comisiones?

#4608

Re: Manipulación de WAMKQ y WAMPQ

¿Un ballenato? o MM a través de sistemas automáticos.